interesting observation - Gemini weight revisited

[alan]

If have noticed some discussions about things like engine power, weight , which are referenced from Holden glovebox manuals. On Wed there is a thread on the weight of gems.
Have a look at these numbers on Gemini weights that I took from a TX,TD,and TF glovebox manual.

Type TX TD TF
sedan 900 924 950
coupe SL 894 918 n/a
wagon n/a 934 971
p/van n/a 904 935

The TX manual says VEHICLE WEIGHT CHART
The TD manual says VEHICLE WEIGHT CHART (ESTIMATED)
The TF manual says VEHICLE WEIGHT CHART (ESTIMATED)

"the estimated ..weight?of a standard vehicle?without options but a full tank of petrol."

I find it strange that while so many people here quote the manual, that no one has noticed these blatant discrepancies? Can anyone account for the 24 kgs difference between a TX and TD sedan, and 50 kgs between a TX and TG sedan? (A smog pump does not weigh 50 kgs!) I can not, and it is hard to believe (all things being equal, both are manual or auto, both have no air con, etc).

The moral of the story is, dont believe everything you read in a GMH book. They can only bother "estimating", whatever that means.

[martin]

i could be wrong but i remember someone in here mentioning that the original TX didnt have beams in the doors or something, that amount of metal would undoubtedly make it a fair bit heavier...

could be wrong but

[TXcoupe]

hmm and also it could be that the TX has a smaller brake resivoir and thinner rotors?

[alan]

Beams? There aint no real beams in any Gem, maybe some light re-inforcing, and it would only weight a few kilos extra per door. so no go with that theory Im afraid.

[alan]

I think the TX master cylinder would weight more actually, its solid cast iron. I have owned a few TX's the rotors/calipers always looked the same as other models.
So no go with that theory either.

[Mark]

The later models definitely have intrusion beams, and one beam came loose on my td coupe and i had to remove it (pain in the arse) to stop it banging around and i would have guessed that it weighed at least 10 kilos on its own.
Txs have no swaybars front or rear either. One of them would weigh 5 kilos or so.
The later models had better reinforced seats, laminated windscreens( if that makes any difference to weight or not)
hubcaps also. (base model txs didnt have hubcaps)

[martin]

well that info will make every tx driver feel safe when a volvo runs a red light

[Benjamin]

Or when he understeers on oil to head on with a Corolla...

[alan]

a 10 kg intrusion beam? I have a collection of about 10 doors at home, off te/tf/tg, also have had the doors off a TD and TF panel van, and I dont think I can see anything beam like in there that would weight 10 kgs. I'll check em again though.

Where abouts is that beam mounted in the door? A coupe and van door are identical, right?

[alan]

OK Ive just checked, but the "beam" is a wussy piece of 1.5 mm or so channel. There is no way it weighs 10 kgs. About 2 - 2.5 kg would be more like it. So
Lets say there are 4 of them = 10 kgs
front swaybar = 4 kgs (yeah, I weighed it)
rear s/bar = 2 kgs thats a guess
add on the sleeves and washers for them = 1kg
windscreen weight toughened/laminated = negligible
the seats they all weigh about the same , so negligible.

So there is about 17 kg, so theres 7 kg missing between a base model TX, and a radial tuned TD.

Maybe the diff weighs a bit more, the outer housing looks bigger, but when you add all that up and reach 924 kg, Holden claim the TF weighs another 26 kg.

Like I said, apart form the smog pump (5 kg), I dont think so. So my original comment stands.

As midnight oil said "When the general talks, you better listen to him", but you should know, that was a sarcastic song...................

any way thats 16 kg

[Mark]

Coupe and van doors are totally different dude.
The intrusion beam runs the lenght of the door about half way up, its about 6 inches wide and is made of thick steel.
Ive got spare doors herem complete with glass, some of txs some of tds. the weight difference is substantial hey.